Wednesday, September 14, 2005

the hidden nature of God and time paradox

Here's summary of my take on theodecy.



God wants us to seek hm in the heart so we will invernalitze (that means really believe) certain values that we would not get if we just were confronted with big proof of God's existence, but didn't have to make a leap of faith to believe.

so God wants us to seek and to rely on faith. That means he cant' make a worl din which it's totally obvious that he exists. There has to be room for dobut otherwise it would not be faith.

Moreover, in oder to carry this program, we have to be able to choose. That's because we can't seek and find and adopt internalized values if we dont' have to make moral choices. but choice means the posslbity of choosing wrongly. So that's why God is hidden and the world is screwed up.

But we could make the world a paradise overnight. if we all just follow Jesus everyting would be great.

what's your excuse?

no don't resort to circular reasoning and saying "I dont' believe" of course you don't because it's not obvious. But what are you doing about seeking God?


That's the upshot of what I call "soteriological drama."

On message board (Apologetics.org) I find that some atheists are incredulous for several reasons. The main one seems to be that they've just accepted the bromides that evi in world has to equal no God. Some have accepted this to the point of calling me names not believing it. In fact, Holy Irony Batman, even though they are refussing to think about my answer, they accuse me of being the one not thinking becasue I am not buying their brmides uncritically. People are so funny arent' they?

One of the major arguments they make is the time thing. O if God knows the future than it's detemrinistic becuase God know it works out that way so it has to. It's like magic, God knows this so it can't work differently than God knows.

This is wha thtey are using on that board to blame God for sin. That's the context of the whole discussion, God is to blame for my sins because he knew I would committ them and that mean old God gavme me a chance to choose anyway.

The key there is I choose. God doesnt' choose for me. they wil admit this but still argue if God knows the outcome it must be deterministic. Doesnt' anyone read Beithius anymore?

But the time thing is stupid. Because we can change our minds, God will simpley know something differnt as the outcome. We do the chooseing. Moreover, God doesnt' know by magic. He either knows only by probalbity, in which case lots of things could change, or he knows by virture of his proximity to time. That's crucial because it means it's not happening out of some magic formula that says if God knows it has to be. It's happening because God really knows that's the way it happens. God knows what happens, that doestn' mean it makes it happen; we still do the choosing.

Of course a generation raised upon blaming the victim and refual to take resopnsibilty for one's own actions will always be able to blame authority figures for their own short comings.

12 comments:

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J.L. Hinman said...

Really? Garage sale finder? What is their theology like?

J.L. Hinman said...

Larry David's Wife? I can only make so many theology jokes at a time you know.

Chairman eDog said...

Here's a summary of my take on theodecy: it's a very clunky and overly greek sounding word. God also asked me to request that you stop trying to figure out his game. Answer questions of this world, and revel in the mystery of the next one.

Anonymous said...

ugh, just can't get away from pop-ups, even on blogs.... should we call them blog-ups?

Anonymous said...

What do you think theologically of the idea that God knows space time "potentials" (analogous to particle trajectories) rather than a predetermined future? IOW, we can look into space and see the past, but not the future, maybe because it doesn't actually exist yet as things move through space and time. I guess I'm saying that maybe the future isn't deterministic even from God's perspective?

J.L. Hinman said...

At 10:03 AM, Chairman eDog said...
Here's a summary of my take on theodecy: it's a very clunky and overly greek sounding word. God also asked me to request that you stop trying to figure out his game. Answer questions of this world, and revel in the mystery of the next one.



no he didn't. But I guess should point out that all of my answers are hypothetical. They are just reasons not make skeptical assumptions. They are not meant to be "real ansnwers."

J.L. Hinman said...

"What do you think theologically of the idea that God knows space time "potentials" (analogous to particle trajectories) rather than a predetermined future? IOW, we can look into space and see the past, but not the future, maybe because it doesn't actually exist yet as things move through space and time. I guess I'm saying that maybe the future isn't deterministic even from God's perspective?"

yea I agree. The Bible doesn't say God knows the entire future as a done deal. C.S. Lewis popularized he idea of God outside of time seeing it all in one moement, but that's not necessarily the case. "Outside of time" may be a fantasy with no real possiblity.

Anonymous said...

OMG he's still at it.

Anonymous said...

Yeah, he's still at it. It's #%$ better'n listening to the mental 8 yr olds.

J.L. Hinman said...

ahahahahaahahah!